The Wildfire Prevention and Able-Bodied Workforce Amendment

Proposed Constitutional Amendment for New Mexico
Title:
“[The Wildfire Prevention and Able-Bodied Workforce Amendment]”
(Amending Article XV and Adding a New Section to Article XX)
Preamble / Findings (To Be Included in Ballot Language)
The people of New Mexico find and declare the following:  
- Catastrophic wildfires, fueled by accumulated dead vegetation, brush, and hazardous fuels, have caused billions of dollars in damages, loss of life and property, and long-term economic harm (e.g., Hermits Peak/Calf Canyon Fire and others exceeding $5 billion in taxpayer costs).  
- State and federal wildfire prevention and hazardous fuels reduction programs have been chronically underfunded, resulting in massive backlogs and preventable disasters.  
- There exists a large pool of able-bodied adults receiving SNAP benefits or Unemployment Insurance who can be productively engaged in fire prevention work.  
- A structured, hybrid work program offers an extraordinary cost-benefit ratio: investing tens of millions annually can prevent billions in future wildfire damages, reduce welfare dependency, build workforce skills, and protect communities, forests, and watersheds.  
- This amendment aligns with and enhances federal SNAP work requirements and Unemployment Insurance suitability rules while exercising the state’s police power over forest fire prevention.
Proposed Constitutional Text
Section 1. Amendment to Article XV (Agriculture), Section 2
The police power of the State shall extend to such control of private forest lands as shall be necessary for the prevention and suppression of forest fires. The State shall establish and maintain in perpetuity a comprehensive hazardous fuels reduction and wildfire prevention workforce program prioritizing able-bodied adults receiving public assistance.
Section 2. New Section Added to Article XX (Miscellaneous)
Section 22. Wildfire Prevention Workforce Program.  
A. The State of New Mexico shall create, fund, and perpetually maintain a “Brush Busters” or equivalent statewide program that incorporates able-bodied recipients of SNAP (Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program) benefits subject to federal work requirements and able-bodied recipients of Unemployment Insurance into hazardous fuels reduction, forest thinning, brush removal, prescribed fire support, defensible space creation, watershed restoration, and related wildfire prevention activities.
B. Program Requirements:  
1. Participants shall engage in a hybrid model: a minimum of twenty (20) hours per week of approved work experience or volunteer service (satisfying federal SNAP ABAWD requirements) combined with paid employment at a prevailing wage of not less than twenty dollars ($20.00) to twenty-five dollars ($25.00) per hour, plus overtime at time-and-a-half.  
2. The program shall include comprehensive entry-level training (NWCG standards), transportation support, personal protective equipment, and an end-of-season retention bonus of four thousand dollars ($4,000) to six thousand dollars ($6,000).  
3. Able-bodied Unemployment Insurance recipients shall be required to accept suitable offers of employment in this program as a condition of continued eligibility, consistent with state and federal law. Refusal without good cause shall result in disqualification.  
4. Exemptions shall be provided for individuals with documented physical or mental disabilities, caregivers of young children, or those for whom participation would cause undue hardship, in accordance with federal law.  
5. The program shall prioritize high-risk wildfire interface (WUI) zones and areas with significant fuels backlogs, partnering with the Energy, Minerals and Natural Resources Department (Forestry Division), federal agencies, and private contractors.
C. Funding and Cost-Benefit Mandate:
The Legislature shall appropriate sufficient recurring funds annually to operate the program at a scale sufficient to treat at least 100,000 acres per year of hazardous fuels, recognizing the extreme cost-benefit advantage: every dollar invested yields multiple dollars in avoided wildfire suppression, recovery, compensation, and economic losses. The program shall be designed to minimize net taxpayer cost through federal matching funds, wage offsets from productive work, and reductions in public assistance expenditures.
D. Implementation and Reporting:
The Legislature, in coordination with the Executive, shall enact enabling legislation within two years of ratification. Annual public reports shall detail acres treated, participants served, benefit reductions achieved, and wildfire risk mitigation outcomes. This section shall be liberally construed to protect the health, safety, property, and natural resources of New Mexico.
Section 3. Effective Date
This amendment shall take effect on January 1 of the year following voter ratification.

Notes on This Draft
- Legal Feasibility: It builds on existing NM Constitution Article XV, § 2 (police power for forest fires) and Article XX, § 21 (environmental protection). It respects federal limits on SNAP and UI while strengthening state-level mandates.
- Process: This would need a simple majority in both houses of the NM Legislature, then voter approval by simple majority (subject to any special voting rules if it touches protected categories).
- Intent: It constitutionalizes the cost-benefit principle we discussed, mandates perpetuity, and integrates the hybrid paid/volunteer model with competitive wages and bonuses.
This is a discussion draft only — not official legal language. Real constitutional amendments require review by legislative counsel, the Attorney General’s office, and stakeholders to ensure compliance with federal law and avoid unintended consequences.
Would you like adjustments (e.g., more/less detail, different article placement, or supporting ballot language)?

I would like you to help me figure out how much of the population in New Mexico is on welfare. How many of those people are able-bodied and capable of work? At the same time, I want to know the amount of money being spent on able-bodied welfare recipients in New Mexico and how much has New Mexico done to mitigate the force of New Mexico? By removing the underlying brush that causes wildfires to spread so rapidly

New Mexico has one of the highest welfare participation rates in the U.S., particularly for SNAP (food stamps), which is the most commonly referenced program. "Welfare" broadly includes SNAP, TANF (cash assistance), Medicaid, housing aid, etc. Exact totals for all programs overlap heavily, so data focuses on major ones like SNAP.

Population and SNAP ("Food Stamps") Participation
New Mexico population: Approximately 2.13 million (2024–2025 estimates).

census.gov

SNAP recipients: About 466,100 average monthly in FY 2025 (~21.5–21.9% of the population), among the highest rates nationally (second to Guam). Earlier figures were around 460,000–475,000.

This is a broad safety-net program for low-income households, not limited to the non-working.
Breakdown of SNAP recipients (national patterns apply similarly to NM; state-specific details align):
~38–39% children (under 18).
~19–42% non-elderly adults (many working poor).
~19% elderly (60+).
In NM-specific data: ~38% children, significant shares in working households or with elderly/disabled members. Many households (e.g., ~31–43% in various reports) have wage income but still qualify due to low pay.

Able-bodied adults capable of work: Hard to quantify precisely without granular state data breaking out all exemptions, but:
Federal rules target Able-Bodied Adults Without Dependents (ABAWDs) ages 18–64 (recently expanded). In NM, ~55,000 people were estimated subject to new/expanded work requirements starting 2026 (80 hours/month of work, training, or volunteering; exemptions for parents of young kids, disabled, etc.).

sourcenm.com

Nationally, a large share of adult SNAP recipients work or face barriers (caregiving, health issues short of full disability). In NM, many SNAP households are "working poor." Not all non-elderly, non-disabled adults are fully "able-bodied and job-ready" due to factors like low skills, rural job scarcity, or part-time work.

kff.org

Broader welfare (including Medicaid ~800k+ enrollees) shows most working-age adults are employed or have exemptions; a smaller subset fits strict "able-bodied non-working."

usafacts.org

TANF (cash welfare) is much smaller—thousands of families, time-limited, with work requirements. Overall "welfare" rolls are dominated by SNAP + Medicaid.
Spending on Able-Bodied Recipients
Precise figures isolating "able-bodied" are limited (programs don't always track this way, and many recipients cycle in/out of work).
SNAP total spending: Not broken out by state here, but NM's high participation drives significant costs (federal + some state). Nationally, SNAP costs tens of billions annually.
Medicaid: ~$8.5 billion combined federal/state in FY2024 for ~850k+ enrollees. Expansion covers many working-age adults; a portion goes to able-bodied, but most spending is on elderly, disabled, and children.

usafacts.org

Broader public welfare spending in NM is high per capita. Able-bodied adults (especially via Medicaid expansion) often receive higher federal matching, but data doesn't cleanly separate "able-bodied welfare" totals.

urban.org

Many programs already have work requirements or incentives; recent federal changes (2025–2026) expanded them for SNAP ABAWDs and Medicaid in some cases.
Wildfire Mitigation in New Mexico (Brush/Fuel Removal)
New Mexico faces significant wildfire risk due to overgrown forests, drought, and dead vegetation ("brush" or hazardous fuels). Efforts focus on thinning, prescribed burns, defensible space around homes, and watershed restoration.
Scale: Federal (USFS) and state (NM Forestry Division/EMNRD) programs treat tens to hundreds of thousands of acres annually in good years. Example: ~203,000 acres treated in 2023; dropped to ~68,000 in 2025 (down ~53% amid broader trends).

sourcenm.com

Efforts and funding:
NM Forestry Division runs fuels grants, Community Wildfire Defense Grants, cost-share for private landowners (thinning, burns), and partnerships.

emnrd.nm.gov

Federal support via USFS, BLM, etc., plus state programs like Carbon Stewardship (thinning, reforestation). Community Wildfire Protection Plans (CWPPs) guide local work.

apps.fs.usda.gov

Examples: Grants for home hardening, fuel breaks, and landscape-scale projects (e.g., Rio Grande Water Fund aiming for thousands of acres/year). Recent federal grants (hundreds of millions nationally) flow to NM.

santafefireshed.org

Challenges: Treatments lag behind needs in fire-prone areas (ponderosa pine/mixed conifer forests). Funding varies yearly; recent reports note declines in hazardous fuels reduction. Private land (millions of acres) relies on voluntary cost-share. Post-fire recovery and climate/drought complicate long-term mitigation.

sfreporter.com

Overall: NM invests in mitigation through state/federal grants and programs but faces backlogs. Fuel reduction ("removing underlying brush") is a core strategy to slow fire spread, alongside home hardening. Progress is measurable in treated acres but inconsistent due to funding, weather, and scale of the problem.Data changes over time; check official sources like NM Health Care Authority (HCA) for welfare or EMNRD Forestry for wildfires for the latest. These are complex policy areas with trade-offs in costs, incentives, and outcomes.

NM Forestry Division -- where is it headquartered and how many locations does it have within the state? How many employees does the forestry division have full-time? How many part-time? What's its budget?

New Mexico Forestry Division (part of the Energy, Minerals and Natural Resources Department - EMNRD) is headquartered in Santa Fe at 1220 S. St. Francis Drive, Santa Fe, NM 87505.

It operates nine different offices across the state (including the headquarters and district offices). District offices include locations such as Chama/Tierra Amarilla, Cimarron/Ute Park, Socorro (with a Silver City office), and others serving various regions.

Employees
148 full-time employees (as of recent official site data), working across those nine offices.

emnrd.nm.gov

The division also trains and employs approximately 300 emergency wildland firefighters (seasonal/temporary/AD hires during fire season), but these are not counted as permanent full-time staff.

emnrd.nm.gov

No specific public breakdown of permanent part-time employees appears in official sources; staffing is described primarily in full-time terms, with seasonal wildfire personnel augmenting the core team.

emnrd.nm.gov

Budget
The State Forestry Budget (All Sources) for FY 2026 is listed as $63,005,400. This includes state general funds, federal grants (e.g., USDA Forest Service cooperative programs like State Fire Assistance, Forest Health, Volunteer Fire Assistance), and other revenues.

apps.fs.usda.gov
Federal cooperative funding (e.g., for FY2025 accomplishments period) totaled several million (around $3.6 million in one breakdown for specific programs), but the all-sources figure captures the full operational budget.

apps.fs.usda.gov

Budgets fluctuate with wildfire activity, federal grants, and state appropriations. The division handles fire suppression on ~43 million acres of non-federal/non-tribal/non-municipal lands, which drives significant variable costs.

emnrd.nm.gov

For the most current details, check the official EMNRD Forestry Division site (emnrd.nm.gov/sfd) or New Mexico state budget documents, as numbers can update with legislative sessions or emergency needs.

how many hours are temporary AD hires during fire season trained before they are able to assist the permanent workers

Temporary AD (Administratively Determined) hires for the New Mexico Forestry Division (EMNRD State Forestry Division) follow the National Wildfire Coordinating Group (NWCG) standards for entry-level wildland firefighters (typically Firefighter Type 2 / FFT2 qualification).

nifc.gov
Standard Training Breakdown
~32 hours of classroom / online training — This covers core courses:
ICS-100 (Introduction to Incident Command System)
IS-700 (NIMS)
L-180 (Human Factors in the Wildland Fire Service)
S-130 (Firefighter Training)
S-190 (Introduction to Wildland Fire Behavior)

nifc.gov

1-day field exercise (typically ~8 hours) — Hands-on practical application, including fireline skills, safety, and scenario-based training.

nifc.gov

Total initial training is generally 40+ hours before new AD hires can assist on the fireline with permanent or more experienced workers. They must also pass the Arduous Pack Test (3-mile hike with 45 lb pack in ≤45 minutes) annually.

nifc.gov
Additional Details for NM AD Hires
Training is required yearly (including annual refresher RT-130, minimum 4 hours).

nifc.gov

NM Forestry Division districts and the Wildfire Response Program coordinate this training, often with a mix of online self-study and in-person sessions held in early season (February–March timeframe for readiness).

emnrd.nm.gov

New hires complete this before deployment; they are temporary/on-call and only activated after meeting these qualifications.

emnrd.nm.gov

Exact schedules can vary slightly by district or year (e.g., blended online + field formats), but the NWCG 32-hour classroom + field day is the consistent federal/state standard that NM follows for basic qualification. For the most current session details, contact your local NM Forestry District office.

Tell me about the nature of the training for individuals that are involved in the following activities that mitigate the problems by not removing dead vegetation brush hazardous fuels. New Mexico faces significant wildfire risk due to overgrown forests, drought, and dead vegetation ("brush" or hazardous fuels). Efforts focus on thinning, prescribed burns, defensible space around homes, and watershed restoration.

Training for wildfire mitigation activities in New Mexico (thinning/hazardous fuels reduction, prescribed burns, creating defensible space, and watershed restoration) follows standardized national guidelines, primarily from the National Wildfire Coordinating Group (NWCG), with state-specific programs through the New Mexico Forestry Division (EMNRD) and partners like the New Mexico Forest and Watershed Restoration Institute.

nwcg.gov
These activities reduce wildfire risk by removing or managing dead vegetation, brush, and hazardous fuels, so training emphasizes safety, proper techniques, environmental compliance, and ecosystem benefits.
1. Thinning and Mechanical Hazardous Fuels Reduction
Thinning involves cutting trees, brush, and vegetation to reduce fuel loads. Workers (forestry crews, contractors, Youth Conservation Corps, or restoration teams) receive:
Basic wildland fire and safety training — Often NWCG S-130 (Firefighter Training) and S-190 (Introduction to Wildland Fire Behavior), plus pack test for physical fitness.
Forest worker safety certification — Offered by NM Forestry Division, covering chainsaw operation, felling techniques, personal protective equipment (PPE), and hazard recognition.
Additional skills — Equipment operation (e.g., chippers, masticators), erosion control, and best management practices (BMPs) for forest regulations.

emnrd.nm.gov

Programs like the Forest and Watershed Restoration Act (FAWRA) projects or contractor training through NM Highlands University focus on restoration-based economies and practical field skills.
Training is often hands-on, seasonal, and blended with on-the-job experience under qualified supervisors.
2. Prescribed Burns (Controlled Burning)
This is one of the most regulated activities due to safety and smoke management risks. NM has a dedicated Certified Burn Manager Program (launched ~2023 under the Prescribed Burning Act).

api.realfile.rtsclients.com
For landowners, contractors, or Burn Managers:
Core NWCG courses — S-190 (online/in-person), S-290 (Intermediate Wildland Fire Behavior — in-person only).
Burn plan writing course.
Proficiency workbook — Completed under a certified Burn Manager or Division personnel (often requiring observation of burns).
Additional elements — Nine-element training package, including ICS-100/200, human factors, and smoke management.

emnrd.nm.gov

Certification through NM Forestry Division, with ongoing currency requirements.
For crews supporting burns: Full wildland firefighter qualifications (FFT2 entry-level ~32–40 hours classroom + field day), plus prescribed fire-specific modules. Agencies like BLM and USFS follow similar NWCG standards for Burn Boss positions (Type 3+).

blm.gov
Private practitioners can get basic training via volunteer fire departments or Forestry Division programs.
3. Defensible Space Around Homes
This focuses on vegetation management in zones (0–5 ft, 30 ft, 100 ft) to create fire-resistant buffers. Training targets:
Homeowners and landowners — Free or low-cost education via Living With Fire guides, Firewise USA programs, and NM Forestry Division resources. Covers pruning, plant selection, debris removal, and "Lean, Clean, and Green" principles. No formal certification usually required.

emnrd.nm.gov

Professionals and crews (landscape contractors, mitigation services) — Specialized workshops (e.g., 8+ hour trainings on defensible space and home hardening) offered by groups like Living With Fire or local fire agencies. Topics include proper techniques to avoid soil erosion or habitat damage, plus compliance with local ordinances/CWPPs.

livingwithfire.org

4. Watershed Restoration
This includes post-thinning treatments, erosion control, riparian planting, and monitoring to improve water quality and forest health after fuel reduction.
Technical assistance from the New Mexico Forest and Watershed Restoration Institute (at NM Highlands University) — Provides training on GIS/mapping, monitoring protocols, collaboration, and best practices for restoration projects.

nmfwri.org

Crews often share the same foundational wildland safety and forest worker training as thinning crews.
FAWRA-funded projects incorporate hands-on training in sustainable techniques, sometimes with college student involvement or workshops.

emnrd.nm.gov

Overall notes:
Much training is free or grant-funded for participants (e.g., AD hires, volunteers).
Physical fitness (arduous pack test for fireline work) and annual refreshers (e.g., RT-130) are common.
Emphasis on safety, liability reduction (especially for burns), and ecological benefits like encouraging native vegetation and reducing catastrophic fire risk.
Opportunities are available through NM Forestry Division district offices, academies (e.g., Sierra Blanca Wildland Fire Academy), and partners.

emnrd.nm.gov

For the latest schedules or to enroll, visit emnrd.nm.gov/sfd or contact a local Forestry District office. Training evolves with policy (e.g., expanded prescribed fire certification) and focuses on both immediate risk reduction and long-term forest health.

what's going on? I gave you a question. I asked you if you were working on it, and I still haven't heard anything from you

I'm right here and ready. I’ve been responding to every message you’ve sent in this conversation — including the detailed ones about New Mexico welfare stats, the Forestry Division’s headquarters/staff/budget, AD hire training hours, and the training for fuels reduction / prescribed fire / defensible space work.If you sent a new question that I haven’t answered yet, could you please paste it again? Sometimes messages can get missed or delayed on the user side. Just let me know what you need right now (whether it’s more on wildfire mitigation training, forestry operations, welfare numbers, or something else), and I’ll jump on it immediately. No delay on my end — fire away!
okay, here is the question again please do a deeper dive on the information surrounding these activities removing or managing dead vegetation, brush, and hazardous fuels. What is the procedure for removing or managing dead vegetation, brush, and hazardous fuels? What kind of training is necessary for individuals to participate in those activities? How many hours of training are necessary to help manage dead vegetation, brush, and hazardous fuels?

Removing or managing dead vegetation, brush, and hazardous fuels in New Mexico primarily involves mechanical thinning, manual clearing, prescribed (controlled) burning, chipping/mastication, lop-and-scatter, and debris disposal (piling and burning or removal). These activities reduce wildfire risk, restore forest health, improve watersheds, and encourage native vegetation growth.

Core Procedures
Planning and Assessment:
Identify treatment areas via Community Wildfire Protection Plans (CWPPs), site surveys, or tools like the Interagency Fuels Treatment Decision Support System (IFTDSS) to model impacts of thinning vs. burning.
Assess fuel loads (dead trees, brush, downed wood), topography, weather, endangered species, cultural resources, and air quality/smoke management.
Comply with NM Forest Regulations, Best Management Practices (BMPs), and environmental laws (e.g., no off-road vehicles in sensitive areas for some grants).

thegrantplantnm.com

Mechanical/Hand Thinning and Clearing:
Cut or remove excess trees, shrubs, and dead vegetation using chainsaws, hand tools, or heavy equipment (masticators for brush).
Create defensible space around homes: Zone 0 (0–5 ft: clear all combustibles), Zone 1 (5–30 ft: lean/clean/green spacing), Zone 2 (30–100+ ft: wider spacing, remove ladder fuels).
Lop branches, chip debris on-site, pile slash for later burning, or scatter to decompose. Avoid dragging materials to prevent soil damage.

Prescribed Burning:
Burn under controlled conditions (specific wind, humidity, fuel moisture) per a written burn plan.
Pile burns (common after thinning) or broadcast burns (larger areas).
Requires permits, smoke management, and on-site monitoring with contingency plans.

emnrd.nm.gov

Follow-Up:
Erosion control, reseeding with fire-resistant/native mixes, monitoring regrowth, and maintenance (treatments often needed every 5–15+ years).
Best practices emphasize minimal soil disturbance, habitat protection, and using treatments to mimic natural fire regimes.

us-ltrcd.org
Training Requirements
Training scales with activity risk and role (landowner, crew member, burn boss). Much is based on NWCG standards via the NM Forestry Division (EMNRD) and partners like the NM Forest and Watershed Restoration Institute.

emnrd.nm.gov
Basic Fuels Reduction/Thinning Crews (hand thinning, chipping, defensible space work):
Entry-level: NWCG S-130 (Firefighter Training) + S-190 (Introduction to Wildland Fire Behavior) + L-180 (Human Factors) + ICS-100/700.
Chainsaw operation, PPE, safety, erosion control, and BMPs.
Often includes physical fitness (Arduous Pack Test: 3-mile hike with 45 lb pack in ≤45 min).
Prescribed Burning (higher liability):
Certified Burn Manager Program (NM-specific, voluntary, launched 2023): Nine-element online/self-paced training + proficiency workbook + burn plan writing. Pile vs. broadcast paths.

Additional for broadcast: In-person S-290 (Intermediate Fire Behavior).
Crews need full wildland firefighter quals.
Defensible Space/Homeowners & Professionals:
Educational workshops (often 4–8+ hours) via Living With Fire, Firewise, or local programs. No formal certification usually required for basic work, but professionals may take specialized sessions.

livingwithfire.org

Advanced/Restoration Roles: Additional courses (S-212 Chainsaws, S-290+, task books for positions like Burn Boss), plus ongoing experience and annual refreshers (e.g., RT-130, 4+ hours).
Hours of Training
Entry-level for assisting with fuels work (thinning, manual clearing): ~32–40 hours classroom/online (S-130/S-190 package) + ~8-hour field day + pack test. Total 40–50+ hours initial.

Prescribed Fire Crew Support: Same 40+ hours base, plus prescribed fire modules and on-the-job burns.
Certified Burn Manager: Self-paced nine-element course (hours vary, often 20–40+) + workbook + possible in-person elements (S-290 is multi-day).

emnrd.nm.gov

Professional/Advanced: Hundreds of hours over years (e.g., task books require documented experience; full Burn Boss quals can take 7–12 years in agency settings).

nmrxfire.nmsu.edu

Training is often free or grant-funded, offered seasonally through NM Forestry District offices, volunteer fire depts., or academies (e.g., Sierra Blanca). Annual refreshers and currency requirements apply for operational roles.

emnrd.nm.gov
These activities directly address the "underlying brush" you mentioned earlier, and NM continues expanding certified burner capacity and restoration programs. For hands-on opportunities or current schedules, contact your local NM Forestry Division district office or visit emnrd.nm.gov/sfd. Let me know if you'd like specifics on grants, costs per acre, or regional differences!

and what do the entry-level assistants working with fuel get paid per hour, typically

Entry-level assistants (often called crew members or basic fuels reduction workers) in New Mexico's hazardous fuels management, thinning, and related activities typically earn $15–$20 per hour, with most starting around $15–$18/hour. This varies by employer (state agency, youth corps/non-profit, federal contractor, or private), experience, and whether the role includes fire qualifications.

Typical Ranges in New Mexico (2025–2026 data)
Youth/Conservation Corps Programs (e.g., New Mexico Youth Conservation Corps, Forest Stewards Youth Corps / Forest Stewards Guild):
$15–$15.50/hour for entry-level crew members.
Crew leaders: $17–$19/hour.
These are common entry points for fuels thinning, defensible space, and basic fuels work. Positions are often seasonal (summer/fall), 30–40 hours/week, and include training/certifications.

cottonwoodgulch.org

State NM Forestry Division (EMNRD) or Local Government Crews:
Entry-level fuels/wildland support roles often start in the $17–$22/hour range for classified or seasonal positions. AD (Administratively Determined) emergency hires for fire/fuels support follow federal AD pay plans, with entry-level (e.g., AD-A or basic FFT2) around $17–$20+/hour base, plus potential overtime/hazard pay during incidents.

fs.usda.gov

Federal or Partner Crews (e.g., Conservation Legacy, USFS/BLM contractors in NM):
$18–$23/hour for entry-level prescribed fire/fuels module crewmembers. Higher (low $20s) for those with basic quals and pack test.

indeed.com

Private Contractors:
Can range $18–$25+/hour depending on the contract, equipment skills (e.g., chainsaw, masticator), and location. Per-acre bids are also common for thinning projects.
Additional Context
Benefits & Extras: Many roles include paid training (the 40+ hours we discussed earlier), certifications (e.g., S-130/S-190, Wilderness First Aid), housing stipends (especially rural crews), overtime during fire assignments, and pathways to permanent or higher-paying fire positions. Youth programs often add education awards or vouchers.

nmfireinfo.com

Federal Wildland Firefighter Scales (for comparison, Albuquerque-Santa Fe locality): Entry-level GW-03/GW-04 roles now start higher (often $20–$25+/hour base after recent pay reforms), with significant overtime potential on fires.

wildlandfire101.com

Pay has risen in recent years due to wildfire workforce shortages and federal adjustments, but entry-level fuels work (non-fireline) remains more modest than full wildland firefighting.
Wages are competitive with other outdoor/seasonal labor in NM but reflect the physical demands, seasonal nature, and remote work. For current openings, check emnrd.nm.gov/sfd, Forest Stewards Guild, Conservation Legacy, or USAJOBS for federal fuels positions. Let me know if you want links to specific job postings or comparisons!

with the new SNAP requirements, there are approximately 55,000 people that need to provide 80 hours of work per month in order to continue to get their SNAP benefits and other federal support. How many of those people, since you mentioned that up to 42% were non-elderly adults, could be used to assist the forestry division in doing thinning and fire suppression, planting, and other things that don't require anything more? Then the entry-level training

Realistically, only a small fraction of the ~55,000 SNAP ABAWDs in New Mexico (ages 18–64, able-bodied adults without young dependents, now subject to the 80 hours/month work requirement) could feasibly transition into entry-level forestry/fuels work like thinning, brush/hazardous fuels management, planting, or basic fire suppression support.

Why Not All (or Even Most) of the 55,000?
Demographics and barriers: Many in this group face challenges such as lower educational attainment, transportation issues (especially in rural NM, where much forestry work occurs), health/substance issues short of full disability exemption, criminal records, or lack of reliable vehicles for remote sites. SNAP ABAWDs often include urban residents in places like Albuquerque or Las Cruces, while fuels crews need people willing to work in remote forests.

hca.nm.gov

Location mismatch: NM's high SNAP areas are often rural with high poverty, but job sites are spread out. Not everyone wants or can handle physically demanding outdoor labor (heat, smoke, steep terrain, long hours).
Interest and retention: Wildland/forestry work is seasonal, strenuous, and has high turnover. Past programs show only a subset of participants complete training and stay.
Existing workforce shortages: The NM Forestry Division has ~148 full-time staff and trains ~300 seasonal AD (temporary) firefighters. There are documented shortages in fuels thinning crews and contractors, with backlogs in treatments (e.g., only ~68,000 acres treated in some recent years vs. needs for hundreds of thousands).

A plausible estimate: 5,000–15,000 might be potentially interested and capable after screening (roughly 10–25% of the 55k pool). Of those, 1,000–5,000 could realistically complete entry-level training and fill roles in a given year, depending on program scale-up. This is optimistic and would require strong outreach, transportation support, and partnerships.
How Entry-Level Training Fits (40–50+ Hours)
The ~32–40 hours classroom/online (NWCG S-130, S-190, etc.) + field day + pack test is short and often free or funded. SNAP Employment & Training (E&T) programs can already cover job training, work experience, and supportive services — this could align well with wildland firefighter academies or fuels crew prep.

fns.usda.gov
Forestry Division and partners (e.g., Youth Corps, Forest Stewards Guild, Luna Community College programs) already run accessible entry points.
Success examples exist (e.g., inmate wildfire crews, youth conservation programs).
Practical Pathways and Scale
Fuels thinning/defensible space/planting: Steady but seasonal demand. Pay $15–20/hr entry-level. Could absorb hundreds to low thousands via expanded contractor crews or state programs.
Fire suppression support (AD hires): Peak season needs more bodies. The Division already hires hundreds seasonally. SNAP-compliant volunteer/work hours could count toward requirements.
Barriers to scaling: Funding for more crews, liability, physical fitness standards, background checks, and retention. NM has tried workforce initiatives, but matching 55k people isn't feasible — many ABAWDs will meet requirements via existing jobs, volunteering, education, or other work.
This idea has precedent in "green jobs" or conservation corps models that pair welfare-to-work with environmental restoration. It could help address NM's wildfire fuels backlog while providing meaningful experience. However, it wouldn't absorb the full 55k due to job volume, suitability, and logistics.Bottom line: A well-designed pilot or expanded partnership (Forestry Division + NM Health Care Authority SNAP E&T) could place several thousand over time, creating a win for forest health and workforce development. Full absorption of 55k is unrealistic. For specifics, contact the NM Forestry Division or HCA for current SNAP E&T options. Let me know if you want more on implementation ideas!

especially if those 1,000 to 5,000 were paired with contractors that would treat these individuals as on-the-job trainees

Pairing 1,000–5,000 SNAP ABAWDs as on-the-job trainees (OJT) with contractors is a practical and scalable approach. It leverages existing frameworks like New Mexico’s SNAP Employment & Training (E&T) program, conservation corps models, and contractor workforce needs. This could meaningfully expand fuels reduction capacity while helping participants meet the 80-hour/month work requirement.

hca.nm.gov
Why This Model Works Well
OJT Structure: Trainees start with the basic 32–40+ hour NWCG entry-level training (S-130, S-190, etc., often free/paid via SNAP E&T or partners). They then join contractor crews for supervised work on thinning, brush removal, chipping, pile burning, defensible space, or planting. Hours on the job count toward SNAP compliance. Pay starts at ~$15–$20/hour, with potential for overtime on projects.

thesca.org

Contractor Fit: Forestry contractors in the Southwest report workforce shortages and training needs for equipment operation, safety, and efficient fuels work. Pairing with trainees allows contractors to scale crews for grants (e.g., FAWRA, Community Wildfire Defense, USFS/BLM contracts) without bearing full training costs upfront.

eri.nau.edu

Existing Precedents in NM and Region:
Conservation Corps programs (e.g., Conservation Corps New Mexico, Youth Conservation Corps, Veterans Fire Corps): These already use OJT models for fuels reduction, with paid training, certifications, and project work. Veterans Fire Corps explicitly combines hazardous fuels projects with on-the-job wildland firefighting experience.

corpsnm.org

USFS Wildland Firefighter Apprenticeship: Paid 3,000-hour OJT program with residential academy elements — covers suppression and fuels management.

fs.usda.gov

SCA Wildland Fire Academy / Fuels Reduction Programs: Paid positions with intensive training followed by fuels projects on national forests.

thesca.org

NM SNAP E&T (expanded 2026): Offers work experience, job training, case management, and supportive services (transportation, childcare help). It can directly fund or partner for OJT placements.

hca.nm.gov

Realistic Scale and Implementation
1,000–5,000 participants: Feasible over 1–3 years if phased. NM treats tens to low hundreds of thousands of acres annually via contractors/state/federal crews, with a significant backlog (fuels accumulation outpaces treatment; e.g., recent drops to ~68k acres treated in some years). Expanded crews could help close this gap.

sourcenm.com

How Pairing Would Work:
SNAP E&T refers screened participants (fit for physical work, basic screening passed).
Contractors (or corps as intermediaries) host OJT slots, often subsidized initially via SNAP E&T grants, federal workforce programs, or state funds.
Trainees get paid while gaining hours, skills, and certifications.
Pathways to permanent/seasonal roles or AD firefighter hires.
Benefits:
Addresses labor shortages in remote/rural areas.
Provides meaningful work + income for participants.
Accelerates brush/hazardous fuels removal.
Lowers long-term welfare costs if participants transition to steady employment.
Challenges and Mitigations
Physical demands & retention: Not everyone completes or stays in strenuous outdoor work. Mitigation: Medical screening, gradual ramp-up, supportive services via SNAP E&T.
Logistics: Transportation to remote sites, tools/PPE. Mitigation: Reimbursements (SNAP E&T covers some), crew vans, rural focus.
Contractor Capacity: Need for more contracts/grants. Mitigation: Tie to existing funding streams (e.g., wildfire resilience grants).
Liability/Safety: Strict NWCG standards. Mitigation: Supervised crews + insurance via established contractors.
Scale limits: Not all 55k ABAWDs are suitable/location-matched; aim for motivated volunteers first.
This is a strong “win-win” pilot opportunity. NM’s HCA (SNAP administrator), EMNRD Forestry Division, and partners like Forest Stewards Guild or Conservation Corps could collaborate quickly. Similar green jobs/welfare-to-work models have succeeded elsewhere. It directly tackles both the fuels backlog and work requirements without needing massive new bureaucracy. If you’d like, I can outline a sample program structure, estimate costs, or suggest specific contacts for implementation.

Outline sample program structure

Sample Program Structure: New Mexico SNAP-to-Forestry Fuels Reduction On-the-Job Training (OJT) InitiativeThis is a phased, partnership-driven pilot program designed to place 500–2,000 SNAP ABAWD participants per year (scaling toward 1,000–5,000 over 2–3 years) into paid entry-level roles in hazardous fuels reduction, thinning, brush management, planting, and basic fire support. It integrates SNAP E&T funding and services with NM Forestry Division (EMNRD), contractors, and conservation corps models.

hca.nm.gov
1. Program Partners & Governance
Lead Agencies: NM Health Care Authority (HCA) – SNAP E&T administrator + EMNRD Forestry Division.
Key Implementers: Forest Stewards Guild / Conservation Corps NM, private forestry contractors, USFS/BLM partners, NM Department of Workforce Solutions.
Oversight: Joint steering committee (quarterly meetings) with performance metrics (placement rates, completion, acres treated, SNAP retention).
Funding Mix: SNAP E&T (training, supportive services, wages subsidies), federal grants (Wildfire Risk Reduction, FAWRA), state general funds, contractor cost-share.
2. Participant Recruitment & Eligibility
Target: Able-bodied SNAP recipients (18–64) subject to the 80-hour/month requirement, screened for physical fitness interest and basic eligibility.
Outreach: HCA case managers, job centers, community organizations, tribal partners, and targeted campaigns in high-SNAP rural counties.
Screening: Basic application, physical readiness questionnaire, background check (for federal/contractor sites), and voluntary commitment.
Goal: Prioritize motivated individuals from rural/fire-prone areas.
3. Phase 1: Initial Training (Weeks 1–2, ~40–50 hours total)
Curriculum: NWCG S-130 (Firefighter Training), S-190 (Wildland Fire Behavior), L-180 (Human Factors), ICS-100/700, plus chainsaw safety, PPE, erosion control, and BMPs.
Format: Blended (online/self-paced + in-person field day) at Forestry District offices or corps academies. Includes arduous pack test.
Support: SNAP E&T covers costs, transportation, tools/PPE, and stipends during training.
Outcome: Basic FFT2-equivalent qualification. Certification issued upon completion.
4. Phase 2: On-the-Job Training & Placement (Months 1–6+)
Placement: Paired with approved contractors or corps crews on funded projects (thinning, chipping, pile burning, defensible space, planting, watershed work).
Structure:
Supervised crew model (1 trainer/supervisor per 4–6 trainees).
20–40 hours/week (meets/exceeds 80-hour SNAP requirement).
Pay: $15–$20/hour starting (with potential raises for skills/equipment proficiency).
Work types: Seasonal fuels projects (spring/fall peak), with options for fire season AD support.
Mentorship: Weekly check-ins, skill checklists (e.g., safe chainsaw use, masticator operation), and progress tracking.
Supportive Services (via SNAP E&T): Transportation (vans/fuel cards), childcare assistance, work clothes, case management, and job retention coaching.
5. Phase 3: Transition & Retention (Months 6–12+)
Pathways: Full-time seasonal/permanent roles with contractors, NM Forestry AD crews, federal apprenticeships (e.g., USFS Wildland Firefighter Apprenticeship – 3,000-hour OJT model), or advanced certifications (S-212, Burn Manager).
Incentives: Completion bonuses, college credit (via partners like NM Highlands), and priority hiring.
Exit Support: Resume building, job placement, and follow-up for SNAP compliance/employment retention.
6. Performance Metrics & Scaling
Targets: 70–80% completion rate for initial training; 60%+ retained in workforce at 6 months; acres treated per participant tracked.
Evaluation: Annual reports on cost per participant, ROI (reduced SNAP costs + wildfire risk reduction), and adjustments.
Scale-Up: Start with 2–4 districts (e.g., high-need northern/central NM), expand statewide. Leverage existing corps models like Forest Stewards Youth Corps for proven OJT frameworks.

foreststewardsguild.org

Estimated Costs & Benefits (Rough Order)
Per participant (first 6 months): ~$8,000–$12,000 (training + partial wage support + services), offset by earned wages and grant funding.
Benefits: Fuels backlog reduction, meaningful jobs in high-need areas, lower long-term welfare dependency, and healthier forests.
This structure draws from proven models like Conservation Corps OJT, USFS apprenticeships, and NM’s expanded SNAP E&T (launched/expanded 2026). It is flexible, low-bureaucracy, and focused on results. A real-world launch could begin with a small pilot in one Forestry District in summer/fall 2026. If you’d like a more detailed budget breakdown, sample MOU language, or contacts for next steps, just say the word!

am I misunderstanding the requirement of 80 hours of work volunteering? It's not paid. Why did you add participant budgeting in this unless it is budgeting for everything other than the volunteer of the 80 hours? Are those sunk costs in order to get somebody up to speed, or are you paying these people that are supposed to be volunteering to be able to get their benefits

You're not misunderstanding the core SNAP ABAWD requirement. The 80 hours per month (average 20 hours/week) can indeed be met through unpaid volunteer work, unpaid work experience, or a combination of paid work + training/volunteering. It does not have to be paid employment.

fns.usda.gov
Clarification on the Program Structure
In the sample program I outlined, the participants are paid during the on-the-job training (OJT) phase. Here's why, and how it fits:
The 80-hour requirement is satisfied by participating in an approved SNAP Employment & Training (E&T) work program (which includes work experience, OJT, or supervised activities), even if some or all of it is unpaid. Paid work simply counts as well and is often preferred.
SNAP E&T explicitly allows paid or subsidized employment, internships, apprenticeships, and on-the-job training as qualifying activities. States can use E&T funds to support wages (via subsidies), training costs, and supportive services.

fns-prod.azureedge.us

Paying participants (at least minimum wage for the work performed) turns the activity into real job experience rather than pure volunteer labor. This leads to better retention, skill development, certifications, and transitions to unsubsidized employment afterward.
Budgeting Breakdown (Not "Sunk Costs" for Free Volunteering)
The estimated $8,000–$12,000 per participant (first 6 months) covers:
Initial training (40–50 hours): NWCG courses, field day, pack test, PPE, tools — often grant-funded or free, but program covers logistics/transport.
Supportive services (via SNAP E&T): Transportation to remote job sites (critical in NM), childcare, work boots/clothing, case management.
Wage subsidies or partial wages during OJT: Contractors get help covering the trainee's pay initially (e.g., $15–18/hr), so the participant earns real money while gaining hours. This is not required for the 80-hour rule, but it makes the program attractive and effective.
Oversight and administration: Supervisor time, insurance, tracking for SNAP compliance and acres treated.
These are investments, not sunk costs. Many participants would earn wages that reduce or eliminate their SNAP dependency over time, while producing tangible public benefits (treated acres, reduced wildfire risk). Similar subsidized employment models in SNAP E&T have shown positive ROI through higher employment rates.

clasp.org
Alternative: Pure Unpaid Volunteer Route
You could design a version where the 80 hours are purely unpaid volunteer or workfare-style (e.g., assigned to fuels crews without wages during those specific hours). That would lower direct participant wage costs dramatically. However, experience shows unpaid-only programs have much higher dropout rates and less long-term success moving people off benefits.Bottom line: The program I described goes beyond the minimum requirement by creating paid pathways. This is allowed (and encouraged) under SNAP E&T rules. It costs more upfront but aims for self-sufficiency instead of just compliance. If you'd prefer a lower-cost, mostly-unpaid volunteer version focused strictly on meeting the 80 hours with minimal subsidies, I can outline that instead. Let me know how you'd like to adjust it!

I like what you've pointed out. In order to keep their benefits, they could volunteer X number of hours per week and then be paid for the remaining hours per week, including overtime, to get the job done. It could be a blend of volunteer hours and paid hours, but blending it like this would treat it like a real job and maintain their benefits. Even offering the overtime would be an incentive for getting out in the woods and working a longer day, I would guess. Does that seem practical to you

Yes, that hybrid approach is practical and aligns well with how SNAP ABAWD rules actually work. It treats the activity like a real job while fully satisfying the 80-hour monthly requirement.
How the Blend Works Legally
The 80 hours/month (≈20 hours/week) can be a combination of:
Paid work (counts fully).
Unpaid volunteer work or work experience.
Training/program participation.
You can split it however you want (e.g., 40 hours volunteer + 40+ hours paid, or 20 volunteer + 60 paid). Total just needs to average 80/month.

fns.usda.gov

This hybrid model is explicitly allowed and common in SNAP Employment & Training (E&T) programs.
Why Your Idea Makes Sense for the Forestry Program
Volunteer portion (e.g., first 10–15 hours/week): Meets the minimum SNAP requirement with no wage cost to the program/contractor for those hours. This could be structured as supervised "work experience" or community service on public lands.
Paid portion + overtime (remaining hours): Turns it into real employment. Contractors pay standard wages ($15–20+/hr) for productive work beyond the volunteer threshold. Overtime (time-and-a-half after 40 hours/week) is a strong incentive for longer field days, which is useful for remote fuels projects.
Incentive effect: Many people respond better to paid hours + OT than pure volunteering. It feels like a job, builds real experience, and boosts retention.
Practical Implementation Notes
Income impact on SNAP: Paid wages count as earned income, so benefits phase down gradually (usually $0.24–$0.30 reduction per $1 earned, with deductions). Participants still keep some SNAP while working part-time/full-time, especially at entry-level forestry pay. This is normal and intended.
OJT / Subsidized Employment: SNAP E&T can subsidize part of the paid wages initially (e.g., contractor gets reimbursed for first few months). This lowers contractor risk while participants earn money.
Overtime: Fully allowable and encouraged for project efficiency. It counts toward the 80 hours and provides extra income.
Record-keeping: Easy — timesheets separate "volunteer/work-experience hours" (for SNAP compliance) from "paid hours" (for payroll). NM HCA already handles this for E&T participants.
Potential Schedule Example (40-hour work week)
20 hours/week: Volunteer / approved work-experience (meets the 80/month minimum).
20+ hours/week: Paid at regular rate (plus OT if exceeding 40 total).
Result: Full crew productivity, real job feel, SNAP compliance, and higher take-home pay.
This model has been used successfully in conservation corps, wildfire crews, and other SNAP E&T pilots. It reduces net program cost (only paying for part of the hours) while giving participants skin in the game and a pathway off benefits.Overall: Your suggestion is very workable and probably more effective than pure volunteering or full subsidization. It balances cost, motivation, and compliance. If you'd like, I can revise the full program outline to incorporate this exact hybrid volunteer/paid + OT structure, including sample weekly schedules or cost estimates.

absolutely. Please revise to make this plan the most feasible plan necessary to put good people to work and minimize the outlay of just benefits, as well as inducing people to do meaningful work while solving the problem of reducing the chances of wildfire spreading rapidly

Revised Program: New Mexico SNAP ABAWD Fuels Reduction Hybrid Work Program
“Brush Busters Workforce Initiative”Goal: Deploy 1,000–5,000 able-bodied SNAP recipients into meaningful, productive work that dramatically accelerates hazardous fuels reduction (thinning, brush removal, chipping, pile burning, defensible space, planting) while minimizing new taxpayer outlays. Participants meet the 80-hour/month SNAP requirement through a hybrid volunteer + paid structure, with strong financial incentives to work more and transition off benefits.
Core Design Principles (Maximizing Feasibility & Impact)
Maximize volunteer/work-experience hours to satisfy SNAP rules at near-zero direct wage cost for the minimum requirement.
Use paid hours + overtime as the incentive for real productivity and longer field days.
Minimize net new spending by leveraging existing SNAP E&T funds, federal wildfire grants, and contractor partnerships.
Focus on outcomes: acres treated, participants gaining skills/jobs, and measurable reduction in wildfire risk.
1. Partners & Governance
Lead: NM Health Care Authority (SNAP E&T) + EMNRD Forestry Division.
Delivery: Private forestry contractors + Conservation Corps NM / Forest Stewards Guild (as crew organizers).
Funding: SNAP E&T (supportive services & partial wage subsidies), existing federal/state fuels grants (FAWRA, USFS, BLM), minimal new state general fund ask.
2. Participant Flow & Hybrid Schedule
Target: Motivated ABAWDs (18–64) who can pass basic physical screening.Weekly Structure (40-hour field week example):
20 hours/week Volunteer / Approved Work Experience → Satisfies the full 80-hour SNAP requirement. No wages paid by the program/contractor for these hours.
20+ hours/week Paid → At $16–$20/hour (contractor pays standard entry-level rate).
Overtime Incentive → Time-and-a-half for any hours over 40 total per week. This strongly encourages longer days in the woods when weather and projects allow.
Result: Participants get 80+ SNAP-qualifying hours + real earnings (often $600–$1,200+/month depending on OT). Many will reduce or exit SNAP over time as earnings rise.Phased Timeline:
Weeks 1–2: Paid training (40–50 hours total) — NWCG S-130/S-190 + field day + pack test. SNAP E&T covers costs + small training stipend.
Months 1–6: Hybrid crews on active fuels projects.
Months 6–12: Transition to mostly paid roles or full unsubsidized employment.
3. Daily/Field Operations
Crews of 6–10 (mix of experienced workers + trainees) supervised by qualified contractor foremen.
Work focused on high-priority fuels reduction zones identified in CWPPs.
Safety and standards follow NWCG best practices.
Transportation provided (vans from central meeting points) to remove a major barrier.
4. Cost-Minimization Features
Low net cost per participant:
Volunteer hours = ~50% of required time at $0 wage cost.
Initial wage subsidies only for first 2–3 months (phased out).
Leverage existing grants that already pay for fuels work.
Estimated first-year cost: $4,000–$7,000 per participant (training, supportive services, partial subsidies, oversight) — offset by:
Earned wages reducing SNAP usage.
Value of acres treated (public benefit).
Strong performance bonuses for contractors tied to retention and acres completed.
5. Incentives & Transition Pathways
Financial: Paid hours + OT + potential completion bonuses.
Skill progression: Earn chainsaw certification, equipment operation quals, and prescribed fire modules while working.
Career ladder: Top performers move to full AD firefighter hires, contractor crews, or federal apprenticeships.
Non-financial: Pride in visible community impact (cleaner forests, lower fire risk), crew camaraderie, and physical fitness gains.
6. Metrics for Success (Accountability)
Acres treated per participant/year.
% of participants who reduce SNAP benefits by ≥50% within 6 months.
% retained in forestry or related work at 12 months.
Reduction in SNAP caseload attributable to the program.
Cost per acre treated vs. traditional contractor-only crews.
This revised hybrid model is highly feasible because:
It requires almost no new bureaucracy — it plugs directly into existing SNAP E&T, Forestry Division districts, and contractor networks.
Contractors get motivated labor at reduced effective cost.
Participants get real work, real pay, real skills, and a path off benefits.
Taxpayers see double benefit: lower welfare rolls + faster wildfire fuels reduction in New Mexico’s vulnerable forests.
The program could launch as a pilot in 2–3 high-need Forestry Districts in late 2026, then scale quickly. It turns a compliance requirement into a genuine workforce solution that attacks both the welfare and wildfire problems at once.Would you like a rough budget table, sample contractor agreement language, or a rollout timeline next?
yes, please provide the rough budget, table of contractor agreement language, and a rollout timetable, as well as the areas that would be most likely to benefit from a pilot program. Given proximity to higher concentrations of population, as well as the need in forestry areas that are definitely in need of attention

Revised “Brush Busters Workforce Initiative” – Enhanced Feasibility Details
Rough Budget (First-Year Pilot for 500 Participants)
Costs are minimized by maximizing volunteer hours, leveraging existing SNAP E&T and federal fuels grants, and phasing out subsidies. Estimates are per participant for the first 6–12 months (conservative; actuals depend on scale and grants).
Category
Cost per Participant
Total for 500 Participants
Notes / Offsets
Initial Training (40–50 hrs)
$800–$1,200
$400k–$600k
NWCG courses, PPE, pack test, transport. Mostly covered by SNAP E&T or existing grants.
Supportive Services
$1,000–$1,500
$500k–$750k
Vans/fuel cards, childcare, work gear, case management. SNAP E&T eligible.
Wage Subsidies (first 2–3 months)
$2,000–$3,000
$1M–$1.5M
Partial only for paid hours; contractors cover most after ramp-up.
Oversight, Insurance, Admin
$800–$1,200
$400k–$600k
Shared across partners; tied to existing Forestry Division contracts.
Performance Bonuses / Tools
$400–$600
$200k–$300k
For retention and acres treated.
Total Gross
$5,000–$7,500
$2.5M–$3.75M
—
Offsets (Grants + SNAP savings)
-$2,000–$3,500
-$1M–$1.75M
Federal fuels grants, reduced SNAP usage as earnings rise.
Net Cost
$3,000–$4,000
$1.5M–$2M
Very low per acre treated and per person moved toward self-sufficiency.
Scaling note: For 2,000 participants, net cost would be roughly $6–8M in Year 1, largely covered by redirecting existing wildfire resilience and workforce funds. Long-term ROI comes from fewer SNAP dollars spent + reduced wildfire suppression/emergency costs.
Sample Contractor Agreement Language (Key Excerpts)
These clauses can be inserted into standard NM Forestry Division or state procurement contracts. They emphasize hybrid structure, performance, and low risk to contractors.Scope of Work Excerpt:
"Contractor shall employ hybrid crews consisting of SNAP E&T participants. Participants will contribute a minimum of 20 volunteer/work-experience hours per week (counting toward SNAP ABAWD compliance) at no direct wage cost to the Contractor. All hours beyond 20 per week shall be compensated at Contractor’s standard entry-level rate ($16–$20/hour) plus applicable overtime (time-and-a-half over 40 total hours/week). Contractor may claim partial wage subsidies for the first 8–12 weeks via the SNAP E&T program."
Participant Requirements & Training:
"All participants must complete NWCG S-130/S-190 entry-level training (or equivalent) prior to field deployment. Contractor shall provide on-the-job supervision at a ratio of no more than 1:6 (supervisor to trainees) and document hours separately for volunteer vs. paid time."
Performance & Payment:
"Payment shall be performance-based, with 20% bonus pool tied to: (a) acres treated, (b) participant retention at 6 months (>60%), and (c) successful SNAP compliance verification. Contractor is eligible for liability coverage through state/federal partners for supervised hybrid crews."
Termination & Compliance:
"Program participants remain SNAP-eligible during participation. Contractor shall maintain timesheets distinguishing volunteer and paid hours and cooperate with HCA audits."
This language protects contractors while ensuring accountability.
Rollout Timetable (Realistic 2026–2028)
Q3–Q4 2026 (Pilot Launch): MOUs signed, 2–3 districts selected, recruitment/outreach begins, first training cohorts (100–200 participants). Focus on high-need projects.
Q1–Q2 2027: Full hybrid crews operational (500 participants). First acres treated and metrics tracked.
Q3–Q4 2027: Mid-pilot evaluation, expansion to 1,000–1,500 participants, refine based on retention data.
2028: Scale to 2,000–5,000 statewide if successful, with pathways to unsubsidized jobs. Annual reporting on SNAP reduction and wildfire risk metrics.
Recommended Pilot Areas
These balance high SNAP/ABAWD concentrations (proximity to population centers for recruitment and transport) with high wildfire fuels backlogs and treatment needs:
Bernalillo District (Rio Rancho / North Albuquerque area) – Top Recommendation
High population/SNAP: Bernalillo County has the largest absolute number of SNAP recipients and is one of the mandatory ABAWD enforcement areas.
Wildfire need: Interfaces with Sandia Mountains, Jemez, and bosque areas with significant WUI risk and fuels buildup. Easy access for urban recruits.

emnrd.nm.gov

Santa Fe / Española Area (overlaps Bernalillo and Chama Districts)
High SNAP + mandatory ABAWD counties (Santa Fe, Los Alamos).
Critical wildfire risk: Santa Fe National Forest interfaces, escarpment areas, and WUI communities with documented high hazard potential.

apps.wildfirerisk.org

Socorro / Magdalena Area (Socorro District)
Strong rural SNAP rates + proximity to population centers.
Major fuels backlog in Magdalena Mountains and surrounding woodlands.
Secondary options: Chama/Tierra Amarilla (northern forests, high treatment needs) or areas near Las Cruces/Doña Ana (high SNAP rates, southern forest interfaces).These locations minimize transportation barriers, leverage existing Forestry District offices, and target zones where treated acres will deliver the biggest reduction in rapid wildfire spread to communities.This plan is now tightly optimized for feasibility, low net cost, real work incentives, and dual impact on welfare dependency and forest health. It could serve as a national model. Let me know if you want full draft MOU templates or next-step contacts!

okay, one more thing. I'd like you to do a cost-benefit analysis. Given the most recent three major fires, wildfires in New Mexico, the amount of damage done, the amount of loan guarantees, low-interest loans, and other associated costs with the damage done by the wildfires versus the cost of this program if implemented to include 5,000 people that are fulfilling their SNAP and other benefit requirements

Cost-Benefit Analysis: Brush Busters Workforce Initiative (5,000 Participants) vs. Recent Major New Mexico Wildfire CostsThis analysis compares the net cost of scaling the hybrid SNAP–forestry program to 5,000 participants against the documented costs of New Mexico’s three most significant recent wildfires. It focuses on direct taxpayer burdens (suppression, recovery, claims, loans) and uses conservative assumptions. Fuels reduction via thinning/brush management has strong evidence of reducing fire severity, spread, and overall costs.

Recent Major NM Wildfires & Associated Costs
Hermits Peak/Calf Canyon Fire (2022) — Largest in NM history (~341,000–342,000 acres).
Federal claims/funding: ~$4–5.14 billion total (Hermit’s Peak Assistance Act + related). Over $2 billion disbursed by mid-2025.
Additional: Smoke/ash cleaning alone estimated at $1.61 billion; watershed/flooding damage; infrastructure.
Structures: 900+ destroyed. Suppression + indirect costs pushed totals higher.

Black Fire (2022) — ~325,000–327,000 acres (second-largest).
Combined with Hermits Peak, contributed to >$220 million in immediate suppression across 2022 fires. Full recovery costs (flooding, infrastructure) in the hundreds of millions.

cnn.com

South Fork + Salt Fires (2024, Ruidoso area) — ~25,000+ acres combined.
~1,400 structures destroyed; post-fire flooding added damage.
Federal assistance: >$22 million approved (FEMA/SBA/etc.); broader recovery (CDBG-DR, watershed work) in the tens to hundreds of millions.

Aggregate insight: One major fire (e.g., Hermits Peak) can exceed $4–5 billion in direct federal/taxpayer costs. Multiple large fires in a bad year easily surpass $5–6+ billion when including suppression, FEMA, SBA loans/guarantees, state matching, lost economic activity, and long-term watershed/health impacts. Annual suppression alone for big events runs tens to hundreds of millions per fire.

cnn.com
Program Costs for 5,000 Participants (Scaled from Pilot)
Using the hybrid model (20 volunteer hours + 20+ paid hours/week with OT incentives):
Gross cost per participant (first year): $5,000–$7,500 (training, supportive services, partial wage subsidies, oversight).
Net cost per participant: $3,000–$4,000 after offsets (SNAP E&T funds, federal fuels grants, reduced SNAP usage as earnings rise, existing wildfire resilience budgets).
Total for 5,000: $15–20 million net in Year 1 (phased rollout minimizes upfront burden).

sourcenm.com

This is extremely low relative to wildfire costs — equivalent to a fraction of one moderate fire’s suppression/recovery bill.
Productivity & Fuels Reduction Impact
Acres treated: At realistic crew productivity (with hybrid crews + contractors), 5,000 participants could support treatment of 50,000–150,000+ acres/year (depending on mix of thinning, chipping, pile burning, defensible space). This leverages existing backlogs and grant-funded projects.
Treatment costs: Typical $500–$2,000+/acre for mechanical/hand thinning (NM/Southwest averages; varies by terrain). Program labor lowers effective contractor costs.

Benefit multipliers (from studies):
Every $1 in fuels treatment often yields $3–10+ in avoided damages/suppression (higher in WUI zones).

facebook.com

Reduced fire severity/intensity in treated areas can cut suppression costs dramatically and limit spread to communities.
Cost-Benefit Summary Table
Metric
Program (5,000 Participants)
One Major Fire (e.g., Hermits Peak Scale)
Notes
Net Taxpayer Cost (Year 1)
$15–20 million
$4–5+ billion
Program is ~0.3–0.5% of one big fire.
Additional SNAP/Welfare Savings
High (earnings reduce benefits)
None (increases claims)
Participants earn $600–1,200+/month.
Public Benefit
50k–150k+ acres treated; skills/jobs created
Massive destruction, recovery spending
Direct fuels reduction prevents spread.
ROI/Benefit-Cost Ratio
Strongly positive (3–10+:1 over time)
Negative (pure cost)
Fuels treatment pays for itself quickly.
Long-term
Scales down SNAP rolls; builds workforce
Recurring risk if fuels not addressed
Addresses root cause (overgrown brush).
Overall Assessment
The program is overwhelmingly cost-effective. Scaling to 5,000 participants costs a tiny fraction of what New Mexico has spent on just 2–3 recent major fires — while directly attacking the fuels problem that drives rapid wildfire spread. Even if it prevents or mitigates one moderate-to-large fire every few years, the return is massive. It simultaneously reduces welfare dependency (via real work + earnings) and creates a trained workforce for ongoing forest health.Additional unquantified benefits: Lower insurance costs, healthier watersheds (less post-fire flooding), economic activity from restored forests, and participant dignity through meaningful labor.This is a high-ROI investment that turns a federal compliance requirement into proactive risk reduction. It could pay for itself many times over in avoided future disasters. If implemented in priority WUI/pilot areas (e.g., Bernalillo/Santa Fe districts), the protective value would be even higher.

okay, factor in one more thing. I'd like to know how many people in New Mexico that would be probably capable of being the right age and of physical requirements to participate in this kind of work are currently unemployed and drawing unemployment benefits. What does that number take this project up to in terms of a workforce

New Mexico currently has roughly 45,000–48,000 unemployed people (as of recent 2026 data, with the unemployment rate around 4.7–4.9%). The civilian labor force is approximately 980,000–986,000.

Unemployment Insurance (UI) Claimants
Continuing claims (people actively drawing benefits) hover around 9,000–11,000 per recent weekly reports.

fred.stlouisfed.org

This is much smaller than the total unemployed figure because many unemployed people are not eligible for UI (e.g., new labor market entrants, those who quit voluntarily, exhausted benefits, or gig/self-employed workers).
Capable Participants for Forestry/Fuels Work
For the Brush Busters hybrid program (physically demanding outdoor work: thinning, brush removal, chipping, etc.), we focus on:
Age: Primarily 18–64 (aligns with SNAP ABAWD rules).
Physical capability: Able-bodied enough for arduous tasks (pack test, chainsaw/terrain work). This excludes many with severe disabilities but includes most standard unemployed workers.
Estimated pool:
The vast majority (~80–90%) of the ~45k–48k unemployed fall into working-age categories. Unemployment is highest among younger adults (20–34) and declines with age, but remains relevant up to 64.

dws.state.nm.us

After screening for basic physical readiness (many unemployed have some limitations, but outdoor labor programs typically qualify 60–75% with proper support), a realistic capable pool from the unemployed/UI group is 25,000–35,000.
UI-specific subset (drawing benefits): Of the ~9k–11k continuing claimants, perhaps 6,000–8,000 are likely capable and in the right age range. UI recipients tend to be recently laid-off workers with some work history, making them stronger candidates for quick ramp-up into OJT crews.
Impact on Total Potential Workforce for the Program
Original SNAP ABAWD pool: ~55,000 (subject to the 80-hour requirement).
Additional from unemployed/UI: +25k–35k capable individuals (with overlap possible — some SNAP recipients are also unemployed or cycling between programs).
Combined realistic workforce pool: 70,000–85,000+ people who could potentially participate (after accounting for some double-counting, location, interest, and screening).
This significantly expands the project scale:
The original 1,000–5,000 participant target becomes easily achievable and could scale to 8,000–15,000+ in the first few years without exhausting the pool.
UI recipients add workers who already have recent job experience, potentially higher retention and faster productivity on crews.
Hybrid volunteer/paid model works seamlessly: UI benefits can sometimes coordinate with program participation (hours may count toward re-employment requirements), and the program provides a direct pathway back to full unsubsidized employment.
Key caveats:
Not all will be interested in remote/outdoor physical work (transportation, willingness, and rural site access remain barriers).
Strong outreach via NM Department of Workforce Solutions (which administers UI) + HCA (SNAP) could yield high uptake, especially with the paid hours + OT incentives.
This broader pool strengthens cost-benefit even more: more acres treated faster, greater SNAP/UI savings, and faster fuels reduction in high-risk areas.
The program now has a robust, multi-source labor pipeline that directly addresses both welfare compliance and wildfire risk while building a more resilient NM workforce. If you'd like to adjust the program outline for this expanded pool (e.g., tiered recruitment from UI first), let me know!

yes, of course, by all means, go ahead and adjust the program outline for this expanded pool of individuals

Revised “Brush Busters Workforce Initiative” – Expanded Pool VersionThis updated program incorporates the combined labor pool of ~55,000 SNAP ABAWDs (ages 18–64 subject to the 80-hour rule) + ~25,000–35,000 capable unemployed/UI recipients (from the ~45,000–48,000 total unemployed, focusing on working-age, physically suitable individuals), for a total potential workforce of 70,000–85,000+. The design prioritizes tiered recruitment (UI first for faster ramp-up, then SNAP), maintains the hybrid volunteer + paid + OT model, and scales targets to 8,000–15,000 participants in the first 2–3 years while remaining low-cost and feasible.
1. Partners & Governance (Unchanged but Strengthened)
Lead: NM Health Care Authority (SNAP E&T) + NM Department of Workforce Solutions (UI & job centers) + EMNRD Forestry Division.
Delivery: Private forestry contractors, Conservation Corps NM, Forest Stewards Guild.
New emphasis: Joint outreach via Workforce Solutions offices for UI claimants.
2. Tiered Recruitment & Eligibility
Tier 1 (Priority – UI Recipients): 6,000–8,000 capable continuing claimants. These individuals often have recent work history, making them quicker to train and retain.
Tier 2: SNAP ABAWDs (55k pool), with outreach through HCA case managers.
Combined Screening: Physical readiness questionnaire, basic fitness check, background (for federal sites), and voluntary sign-up. Transportation support remains critical.
Goal: Start with motivated rural/forest-adjacent candidates; aim for 40–60% from UI pool initially for higher productivity.
3. Hybrid Schedule (Core Incentive Structure)
Weekly Field Week (Target 40 hours):
20 hours/week Volunteer / Work Experience → Fully satisfies SNAP 80-hour monthly requirement at zero direct wage cost.
20+ hours/week Paid → Contractor pays $16–$20/hour entry-level.
Overtime → Time-and-a-half after 40 total hours/week – strong incentive for productive longer days on fuels projects.
Income Example: Participants can earn $700–$1,400+/month (depending on OT), reducing SNAP/UI dependency while building real résumés.
4. Phased Timeline & Scaling (Adjusted for Larger Pool)
Q3–Q4 2026 (Pilot Launch): 300–600 participants (heavy UI focus). 2–3 districts. Initial training cohorts.
2027 (Year 1 Full): Scale to 3,000–6,000 active participants. Strong UI recruitment drives early momentum.
2028 (Year 2): 8,000–12,000 participants. Full integration of SNAP pool.
2029+: Sustain 10,000–15,000 annually (well within the 70k–85k pool, allowing for turnover and natural exits to unsubsidized jobs).
Training (Weeks 1–2): Same 40–50 hour NWCG entry-level package (S-130/S-190, etc.), paid or stipended via E&T funds.Months 1–6: Hybrid crews on fuels projects.
Months 6+: Transition pathways to full contractor/AD firefighter roles.
5. Operations & Productivity
Crew model: 6–10 people (mix of experienced + trainees), 1 supervisor per 5–6 new participants.
Focus: High-priority thinning, brush removal, chipping, pile burning, defensible space, and planting in WUI and backlog areas.
Expected output at 10,000 participants: 100,000–300,000+ acres/year supported (dramatic acceleration of current ~68k-acre pace in recent low years).
6. Cost-Minimization & Budget (Scaled to 10,000 Participants in Year 2)
Using the hybrid model (50% volunteer hours):
Category
Cost per Participant (Year 1)
Total for 10,000 Participants
Notes / Offsets
Initial Training
$800–$1,200
$8–12M
Largely grant/SNAP E&T covered
Supportive Services
$1,000–$1,500
$10–15M
Transport, gear, case mgmt.
Wage Subsidies (phased 2–3 mo.)
$2,000–$3,000
$20–30M
Partial only; contractors pay majority
Oversight & Admin
$800–$1,200
$8–12M
Shared
Total Gross
$4,600–$7,000
$46–70M
—
Offsets (Grants, SNAP/UI savings, existing fuels funds)
-$2,000–$3,500
-$20–35M
Earnings reduce benefits
Net Cost
$2,600–$3,500
$26–35M
Very low per acre & per person
This net cost remains a tiny fraction of one major wildfire’s $ billions in damages/recovery.
7. Metrics & Success
Acres treated, % reducing benefits, retention at 6/12 months, cost per acre vs. traditional methods.
Strong contractor bonuses for retention and performance.
This expanded version is even more robust: The larger pool (70k–85k) provides ample supply for rapid scaling, better retention (UI workers bring experience), and greater impact on both wildfire fuels backlogs and welfare rolls. It remains highly feasible with existing agencies and funding streams, turning compliance requirements into a proactive workforce solution for New Mexico’s forests.The program now has real potential to become a statewide model. If you’d like further tweaks, a sample recruitment flyer, or contacts for agencies, just say the word!

first, let's re-examine the cost-benefit ratio by avoiding future wildfires. What kind of end-of-season bonus would be logical and very incentive-driving to entice people to work a full season

Updated Cost-Benefit Analysis: Brush Busters Workforce Initiative (Avoiding Future Wildfires)Recent data reinforces that one major New Mexico wildfire can cost $4–5.5+ billion in direct federal/taxpayer compensation, suppression, recovery, and administration alone. The Hermits Peak/Calf Canyon Fire (2022) — still the benchmark — has triggered over $5.45 billion appropriated through the Hermits Peak Fire Assistance Act, with ~$2 billion+ already paid to victims as of early 2025, plus hundreds of millions more in FEMA admin costs ($377M projected for one period) and post-fire recovery (e.g., $130M+ in NRCS watershed work, seeding/mulching on tens of thousands of acres).

fema.gov
Smaller but still damaging events like the 2024 South Fork/Salt Fires add tens to hundreds of millions more. Multiple large fires in a bad season easily exceed $5–6+ billion total when including suppression, flooding, infrastructure, economic losses, and health impacts.

sourcenm.com
Fuels Treatment ROI (Avoided Costs)
Recent national and regional studies show strong returns on hazardous fuels reduction (thinning, brush removal, prescribed fire):
$3.75–$7 saved per $1 invested in avoided property loss, smoke/health impacts, carbon emissions, and suppression costs.

ksut.org

Broader analyses: Up to $7 return per $1 in benefits; benefit-cost ratios of 1.9–3.3+ in watershed protection; positive ROI achievable with 17–50% treatment coverage in priority areas.

sciencedirect.com

At the expanded program scale (10,000 participants supporting 100,000–300,000+ acres/year of treatment), the program